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Topic: Impressions from MS Connect

Found in this year free time for review of the given action, directly in real time. Though it is already given I do not use any building tools from MS, but it is interesting to look at tendencies at the fattest players in the industry. While on the first impressions of conference the main focus of the company goes on Asure. From the declared novelties saw while support Docker'a (besides really important for Azure) and OSX (in a role of the computer for the developer). In remaining while any nonsense and water. But conference did not come to an end yet (while at 2,5 hours looked) - if I will see something else interesting I will add in the message. Adding 1. Still an amusing novelty:.net core for Tizen (efforts of Samsung). Basically anything surprising since Tizen is high-grade kernel Linux.

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, alex_public, you wrote: _> In remaining while any nonsense and water. But conference did not come to an end yet (while at 2,5 hours looked) - if I will see something else interesting I will add in the message.  while anything new, the course still has been more or less officially declared one year ago. From new - only MS SQL Express 2016 with the same limits, but with a heap of buns from "adult" editions. Well and VS under Mac with great reserve. With great reserve - since it is renamed Xamarin Studio - time, public leak was three days prior to a connection - two. The only thing, I did not understand - where promised preview new  for.net core with support csproj?

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, alex_public, you wrote: the strange choice of a forum... Judging by , here not , and on the contrary all "merged in ecstasy"

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Sinix, you wrote: S> the Only thing, I did not understand - where promised preview new  for.net core with support csproj? With studio in a box. Templates.NET Core projects already.csproj to migrate "old" core the project on the new circuit with application of such mother and a file it was possible. And ReSharper on it it was got

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, alex_public, you wrote: _> From the declared novelties saw while support Docker'a And that all rush with this docker, as if with a silver bullet? As far as I understand from functionality, it "the virtual machine for beggars" - OS one on all + at everyone the files. Certainly, without any warranty that someone's khaki do not get out for limits of the container and do not get into yours (or occupy percents, a network,  it is necessary). Well and  in it good?

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, qxWork, you wrote: W> With studio in a box. Not, with VS 15 (which the Author continues nice tradition: Sinix Date: 01.06 11:44 becomes 2017) -  clearly. In 2015 too promised. W> templates.NET Core projects already.csproj to migrate "old" core the project on the new circuit with application of such mother and a file it was possible. W> And ReSharper on it it was got I Congratulate Well, time began about : and you casually do not have any plans on selective switching-on / to switch-off of separate features ? Because in  all is class except  and support, with them the full grief-trouble and it is very insulting. The majority of features R# are made and forgotten for ever. In their studio though very slowly (ten years waited, yes), but refine. For example, rename refactoring by forces of bare studio it is implemented ideally - printed a new name, enter - it is ready. For  it is necessary still ctrl-. To push plus to find the necessary action. For example, for the renamed variable Ctrl-. + Enter simply deletes the renamed variable. Seriously? On a question on duty "where ?" The answer on duty - three years as ( not ours, but similar).

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Kolesiki, you wrote: K> And that all rush with this docker, as if with a silver bullet? As far as I understand from functionality, it "the virtual machine for beggars" - OS one on all + at everyone the files. Certainly, without any warranty that someone's khaki do not get out for limits of the container and do not get into yours (or occupy percents, a network,  it is necessary). Well and  in it good? The program starts to work for the developer by the machine. It  the machine together with the program in . The docker.

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Sinix, you wrote: W>> With studio in a box. S> not, with VS 15 (which the Author continues nice tradition: Sinix Date: 01.06 11:44 also becomes 2017) -  clearly. In 2015 too promised. And, by the way, can be. 15th that stood and SDK I for certain put. S> I congratulate Thanks. S> well, time began about : and you casually do not have any plans on selective switching-on / to switch-off of separate features ? ReSharper | Options | Products and Features a little? It would be desirable to disconnect with  ? S> On a question on duty "where ?" The answer on duty - three years as ( not ours, but similar). With  all not absolutely so: so at me looks the menu for just written class near to existing but here if it is nested and without public S> For example, rename refactoring by forces of bare studio it is implemented ideally - printed a new name, enter - is ready. S> for  it is necessary still ctrl-enter to push plus to find the necessary action. For example, for the renamed variable Ctrl-. + Enter simply deletes the renamed variable. Seriously? That is interesting, with rename all is as if it was possible to calculate that the class is not used anywhere its removal for some reason is considered more priority, than rename. It Would be necessary .

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Kolesiki, you wrote: _>> From the declared novelties saw while support Docker'a K> And that all rush with this docker, as if with a silver bullet? As far as I understand from functionality, it "the virtual machine for beggars" - OS one on all + at everyone the files. Certainly, without any warranty that someone's khaki do not get out for limits of the container and do not get into yours (or occupy percents, a network,  it is necessary). Well and  in it good? I would define Docker as one of variants of the installer of a server software under Linux. From advantages over analogs it is possible to mark absence of influence of a software against each other, simplicity of the format of a configuration, great popularity (and as consequence presence of ready "installers" under all popular demons). So perhaps for Linux the let technology know it is necessary for creators of a server software. Well and to administrators it is natural, but it any more to our forum. And remaining on idea even to know such title it is not required.)))

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Kolesiki, you wrote: K> As far as I understand from functionality, it "the virtual machine for beggars" - OS one on all + at everyone the files. No, an essence that it lightweight containers. If fair insulation and the full virtualization is not necessary to you and it is just necessary to launch seven-separately programs that  a variant allows not to spend resources for guest OS.... <<RSDN@Home 1.1.4 stable SR1 rev. 568>>

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, qxWork, you wrote: S>> Well, time began about : and you casually do not have any plans on selective switching-on / to switch-off of separate features ? W> ReSharper | Options | Products and Features a little? It would be desirable to disconnect with  ? Aha, so. These adjustments as though are, only not for all and are scattered on a heap of tabs Because to disconnect all buns  sense are not present, and here to disconnect only a type part rename refactoring, ignoring of standard adjustments of formatting or  at autocompletion it does not turn out. Yes, with rename I slightly told lies, one thousand apologies. Reliznaja version VS 2015 without  does not begin renaming by the automatic machine, it is necessary f2 to push. In any of preview such behavior was, into release did not enter. W> that is interesting, with rename all is as if it was possible to calculate that the class is not used anywhere its removal for some reason is considered more priority, than rename. It Would be necessary . Aha. It is possible still with renaming of a local variable or private method to check up.

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

I will bring a certain total for myself. Not at level of a reality and fine details, and at level of the general sensations of tendencies. MS always showed various  for developers under the platforms. And so this time the similar misses almost for all platforms. And speech at all about completely died WinMobile or and not born WinIoT. There is nothing interesting for the former pillar ( Windows), for the potential perspective future (HoloLens). And only for Azure there is the full union . Including even such amusing novelty (relative since itself  it was possible and to download earlier), as Bot Framework. So impression that MS sees as the personal platform in the future only Azure. And here building tools accordingly on the contrary, start to work under all platforms (except competitors Azure).

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, alex_public, you wrote: _> I Will bring a certain total for myself. Not at level of a reality and fine details, and at level of the general sensations of tendencies. _> MS always showed various  for developers under the platforms. It on//Build/is normally announced. And Connect (); - conference new (the third year only) also is devoted just  to services and a cloud in the core, so norms. However, with winphone as with consumer devices - Izja everything, yes. And it is a pity.

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Sinix, you wrote: _>> I Will bring a certain total for myself. Not at level of a reality and fine details, and at level of the general sensations of tendencies. _>> MS always showed various  for developers under the platforms. S> it on//Build/is normally announced. And Connect (); - conference new (the third year only) also is devoted just  to services and a cloud in the core, so norms. Well so new VS already presented - whence still undertake ?) S> However, with winphone as with consumer devices - Izja everything, yes. And it is a pity. Here is how time winphone is absolutely not a pity, unlike winmobile. And both old winmobile, and new. Initial it was good for the time and deservedly occupied a noticeable share of the market of smart phones. And new (which now planned) too it is good the basic principles (by the way very close to principles old and besides in same a direction slowly drift Android/iOS). Would be, if it let out somewhere in 2007-2009, as continuation of the old. Then it for certain would shoot. But instead of it let out a sad clone iOS with tiles and occupied on useless fuss with it these most 8 years, missing the necessary moment.

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Sinix, you wrote: And here VS2015U3 - , a C ++. There is a list of sentences... And... Here just like all it is good. And here from this list to select that is necessary a normal method it is impossible -  - generally does nothing (closes the list, and on mine enters line feed into the text), TAB - finishes the identifier, but not that which is selected from this list, and that which has been offered the first...

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, alex_public, you wrote: _> Here is how time winphone is absolutely not a pity, unlike winmobile. And both old winmobile, and new. Initial it was good for the time and deservedly occupied a noticeable share of the market of smart phones. And new (which now planned) too it is good the basic principles (by the way very close to principles old and besides in same a direction slowly drift Android/iOS). Would be, if it let out somewhere in 2007-2009, as continuation of the old. Then it for certain would shoot. But instead of it let out a sad clone iOS with tiles and occupied on useless fuss with it these most 8 years, missing the necessary moment. Not absolutely so. Purely technically winphone was really  as under a cowl (to make  TM even on cheap iron more anybody and was not honored), and on reasonableness of basic principles UI. To make of the start screen normal dashboard with uniform style for all indicators - it is invaluable, for all remaining is  Pads on the eight too were unique - they could invent the clear interface in uniform style not on separate visual elements, and in a complex, since standardization of gestures. It was  and was perfectly scaled on phones and smart hours. But here specific implementation of these megaplans -  in all. Marketing, periods, operation with vendors, quality of a software,  separate decisions, even stupidly "at me was the plan and I adhered to it" - all it was , separate things repeatedly. MS in the style

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Vladek, you wrote: V> the program starts to work For the developer by the machine. It  the machine together with the program in . The docker. The tag played new colors

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, qxWork, you wrote: S>> the Only thing, I did not understand - where promised preview new  for.net core with support csproj? W> With studio in a box. . And  yes, without support VS 2015. The first with 2010 studio which breaks backward compatibility of projects, .

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Sinix, you wrote: _>> Here is how time winphone is absolutely not a pity, unlike winmobile. And both old winmobile, and new. Initial it was good for the time and deservedly occupied a noticeable share of the market of smart phones. And new (which now planned) too it is good the basic principles (by the way very close to principles old and besides in same a direction slowly drift Android/iOS). Would be, if it let out somewhere in 2007-2009, as continuation of the old. Then it for certain would shoot. But instead of it let out a sad clone iOS with tiles and occupied on useless fuss with it these most 8 years, missing the necessary moment. S> not absolutely so. Purely technically winphone was really  as under a cowl (to make  TM even on cheap iron more anybody and was not honored), and on reasonableness of basic principles UI. To make of the start screen normal dashboard with uniform style for all indicators - it is invaluable, for all remaining is  Pads on the eight too were unique - they could invent the clear interface in uniform style not on separate visual elements, and in a complex, since standardization of gestures. It was  and was perfectly scaled on phones and smart hours. You here speak about different not basic trifles, type of style GUI, etc., and I speak about the basic bases of a platform defining its development. Here look as all was historically: Initially Android was terribly poor system almost on all parameters. It even was worse than OS of 90-s'. Both on GUI and on a kernel (in the beginning there there was not a normal kernel of Linuh as now, and something corrected) and on building tools. But thus given OS developed fast rates, and in quite unambiguous a direction: becoming more close to high-grade  OS. In the last versions already even appeared normal  (i.e. grew practically to windows 3.1) so in last Androide on a pad it is already possible to be engaged even in simple office operation. With iOS practically too most. Only there initially was (already is not present - Android caught up and overtook) hardly better a technical situation (with a kernel and building tools), but it was completely compensated  "anal " from different directions. That only cost awful iTunes in a role of a unique communications medium of the computer and phone. And so all irony (or grief - to whom as) situations consists that at the moment of a birth iOS and Android at MS already there was operating mobile OS (Windows Mobile) the closest to  (there even was practical identical with adult Windows API). Moreover, this OS took the second place in the market of smart phones. And not after iOS/Android (then they had not time to capture yet the market), and after dying Symbian so the future could be simply remarkable. Was to optimize operatively this OS under the modern iron (a lot of storage,  (instead of pen) the interface, etc.) enough . But "ingenious" managers MS solved on another. Being lost in contemplation of successes iOS and Android (and their shops) they did not understand that successes a consequence were faster some innovative iron (in a case iOS) and platform opennesses (in case of Android), instead of frank wretchedness (it is simple their creators did not master other to unwinding) or . Therefore in MS threw out on a dustbin the existing developed OS (together with its users and developers under it) and developed instead of it the freak (WindowsPhone), imbibed the worst qualities from the first versions iOS and Android. Here was both the underdeveloped interface and poor tools and anal  and still a heap of minuses. And here their experts in marketing tried to push through this poverty on stretch of half of decade, without understanding why it does not fly up. And only after half of decade (for which Android and iOS grew already to almost high-grade OS, i.e. Before that was primary at MS when in the past) in MS reached understanding of a direction of development of these OS and desire of users. Then they at last announced that (by the way, they thus besides threw users and developers WinPhone, but it is already fine, this customary business) the right decision (naming it Windows10 Mobile), being natural continuation of ideas by that ancient Windows Mobile. Only it naturally too did not fly up, because it was necessary to do it 8 years ago, and now the window of possibilities already was closed for a number of reasons. S> but here specific implementation of these megaplans -  in all. Marketing, periods, operation with vendors, quality of a software,  separate decisions, even stupidly "at me was the plan and I adhered to it" - all it was , separate things repeatedly. MS in the style If we speak about WindowsPhone basic architectural principles of the given platform were initially failure (with the presence registration in the market iOS and Android). So nothing could rescue it. P.S. If someone tells that it is easy to write similar analyses now when already all happened I will specify that I wrote (and directly at this forum) about sad future WinPhone still many years ago. And then here still was a lot of people arguing with it.)))

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, alex_public, you wrote: _> If we speak about WindowsPhone basic architectural principles of the given platform were initially failure About what was specific principles speech? _>... About sad future WinPhone still many years ago. And then here still was a lot of people arguing with it.))) I also am now ready to argue. It seems to me that MS  a business organizational part. Plus, categorically is not pleasant to me rotten idea "=". But unification of a reference platform for.NET / Phone could play the favor. Can  my vision, I as "the big architect" would make so: 1. One reference platform for all devices (a collection, a network, , , etc.) . All. consists of packets which are the standard (as in a toad) + indirect units. 2. Separately for mobile (and other categories) devices there are the packets optimized for them. It is obvious that  "" has not something in common with a desktop. For a mobile phone and a desktop the almost general scenario is had: we Collect archive from packets and the main program ( in MSIL). In  all lies separately (up to that the archive contains only the program, and "standard packets" should be already in system). At setting to the PK/DEVICE, (missing) packets globally are delivered in system (as in Linux) and are used by all programs. In idle a mode packets and a program on the sly  in ARM-binari (for example).  carefully and long - we CAN allow it to ourselves, as a part of packets already . At start we have almost full productivity + any superfluous garbage and thus our archives still  MSIL! MSIL too it is time under a knife - it is clumsy and invented in  a burning loss as   on IT. It should be overworked with the registration of that it will work as on Skylake (MMX, SSE, etc.), and on the whole zoo ARM'. I even would admit certain "basic MSIL" (when target it is absolutely unknown and the primitive command set is used) and "expanded" where there are instructions for vectors and other  (and which with ease is broadcast in "basic"). Whether rescues a situation.NET Core? I doubt.... Correct, if I not the rights, but: 1. To a bark it is conceived with compilation at once in target a platform. It is inadmissible, we do not know all zoo of devices where take in head to launch a program (yes though on a microwave!) . In other words, to IoT to a bark it is not ready. 2. To a bark repeats all legacy-garbage, which  (to be exact, pinched from the Toad) unfortunate MS-architects. Multiple return values, readonly collections, portable GUI - all it radically changes API. 3. To a bark came too late, discarding the industry on kind tens years ago. And to it still  and  to a high-grade. net Framework! (GUI where??) 4. To a bark (and C#) it is again sawn under dictatorship MS.  Basic - there. It is not necessary fairy tales about , all is nonsense. We still cannot have the  and we will be dragged for  the mediocrities considering with architects. Time in which we live - sad, is an epoch  industry pillars on the  and origin of the free style. An epoch of changes. Us still continue to stretch (vainly) on terms Azure, AWS and other clouds, but as a whole the industry understands - categorically it is impossible to rely on one company and its sad  architects, it is necessary to live independently and . Here. Write to us to a sport lotto.

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Vladek, you wrote: V> Hello, Kolesiki, you wrote: K>> And that all rush with this docker, as if with a silver bullet? V> the program starts to work for the developer by the machine. It  the machine together with the program in . The docker. In other words, careless  which understands nothing in own vermicelli, instead of accurate units now can  at once the whole pan of a spaghetti! (Perfectly recalled koandrew: "and for me by the machine works!" ) Whether smells slightly here 1) of reduction in price of service full of holes (from the provider) and 2) the induso-approach which will fall all the same. To me as the companies not only  to hold the data/services at numerous "solvers of problems", but also it is twice terrible from these here "cheap substitutes VM" - nevertheless the Docker isolates only ! And how to be with services? OS one! Ports besides... Wanted to hang up that-nt on port 2000, and here  - there already other company  microservice! The docker is interesting as the dynamic server TO ONE company. I.e. there is one physical server, on it "superservice" is twisted, and near it is possible  tens "superservices-2.0", running in on live people and accurately supervising iron expenditures. But when to you expose only "the abstract server", and you there get containers how it is possible to be assured of the maximum productivity and protection??

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Kolesiki, you wrote: _>> From the declared novelties saw while support Docker'a K> And that all rush with this docker, as if with a silver bullet? As far as I understand from functionality, it "the virtual machine for beggars" - OS one on all + at everyone the files. Certainly, without any warranty that someone's khaki do not get out for limits of the container and do not get into yours (or occupy percents, a network,  it is necessary). Well and  in it good? Once all machine fulfilled one program. Interposed a punched card, pushed start-up, the processor fulfilled the program and stopped. Then understood that the processor operating time costs much and started to try to optimize this process, to do multitasking. In early versions of operating systems there was no insulation of programs from each other, storage was the general on everything, the program gave the processor only when itself wants. It was comprehensible, when programs wrote without bugs. As without program bugs it was impossible to write, made the partial insulation of programs from each other. Storage at each program became the, the processor at each program became the and to give it it is not necessary, OS takes away it, when considers the necessary. Actually now  operating systems also are in such type. But at programs still it is a lot of shared locations: file system, network interfaces and many other things. Containers also urged to produce the further insulation of programs from each other. And khaki always will be, it is possible and from  to get out, were such vulnerability. That now, whether to live that.

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Kolesiki, you wrote: _>>... About sad future WinPhone still many years ago. And then here still was a lot of people arguing with it.))) K> I also am now ready to argue. It seems to me that MS  a business organizational part. Plus, categorically is not pleasant to me rotten idea "=". Well there not absolutely the idea "=", and is faster all possibilities  OS in the mobile. To it all modern mobile OS now come. And it is obvious why - the majority normal (not programmers, etc.) Users now come to the scenario of operation with ON/INTERNET in which there is only a smart phone/tablet, and stationary computers/noutov are not present basically. Separately still it is possible to consider strategy uniform API at  and mobile OS (as was at Windows at the time of WindowsMobile). It not a required parameter, but rather convenient for developers since allows elementarily  application. K> but unification of a reference platform for.NET / Phone could play the favor. Can  my vision, I as "the big architect" would make so: K> 1. One reference platform for all devices (a collection, a network, , , etc.) . All. consists of packets which are the standard (as in a toad) + indirect units. Here provision was exceptional.net the interface for development under WinPhone the first versions of one of the roughest architectural errors, Androida copied from the first versions. In the subsequent versions of Androida and WinPhone it has been operatively corrected (appearance NDK and WinRT), but it was possible similar obvious  not to do initially. K> 2. Separately for mobile (and other categories) devices there are the packets optimized for them. It is obvious that  "" has not something in common with a desktop. GUI unconditionally should be a miscellaneous on different devices. But it is possible to provide it at level of implementation in OS, with saving uniform API. K> For a mobile phone and a desktop the almost general scenario is had: K> we Collect archive from packets and the main program ( in MSIL). In  all lies separately (up to that the archive contains only the program, and "standard packets" should be already in system). At setting to the PK/DEVICE, (missing) packets globally are delivered in system (as in Linux) and are used by all programs. In idle a mode packets and a program on the sly  in ARM-binari (for example).  carefully and long - we CAN allow it to ourselves, as a part of packets already . K> At start we have almost full productivity + any superfluous garbage and thus our archives still  MSIL! Just so now works Android with  (Java) the code. Basically it agree that it is the good approach. K> MSIL too it is time under a knife - it is clumsy and invented in  a burning loss as   on IT. It should be overworked with the registration of that it will work as on Skylake (MMX, SSE, etc.) And on the whole zoo ARM'. I even would admit certain "basic MSIL" (when target it is absolutely unknown and the primitive command set is used) and "expanded" where there are instructions for vectors and other  (and which with ease is broadcast in "basic"). It is actually possible to take ready LLVM. As it already has effective optimizers under all important processors. Whether K> Rescues a situation.NET Core? I doubt.... Correct, if I not the rights, but: K> 1. To a bark it is conceived with compilation at once in target a platform. It is inadmissible, we do not know all zoo of devices where take in head to launch a program (yes though on a microwave!) . In other words, to IoT to a bark it is not ready. K> 2. To a bark repeats all legacy-garbage, which  (to be exact, pinched from the Toad) unfortunate MS-architects. Multiple return values, readonly collections, portable GUI - all it radically changes API. K> 3. To a bark came too late, discarding the industry on kind tens years ago. And to it still  and  to a high-grade. net Framework! (GUI where??) K> 4. To a bark (and C#) it is again sawn under dictatorship MS.  Basic - there. It is not necessary fairy tales about , all is nonsense. We still cannot have the  and we will be dragged for  the mediocrities considering with architects. How much I see.NET Core is intended only for capture of the market of Web servers on Linux (dominating at present). It like as quite suits the given role. K> time in which we live - sad, is an epoch  industry pillars on the  and origin of the free style. An epoch of changes. Us still continue to stretch (vainly) on terms Azure, AWS and other clouds, but as a whole the industry understands - categorically it is impossible to rely on one company and its sad  architects, it is necessary to live independently and . It is not assured that it understand already all.)))

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, Kolesiki, you wrote: K> To me as the companies not only  to hold the data/services at numerous "solvers of problems", but also it is twice terrible from these here "cheap substitutes VM" - nevertheless the Docker isolates only ! And how to be with services? OS one! Ports besides... Wanted to hang up that-nt on port 2000, and here  - there already other company  microservice! For justice the docker isolates not only , but also a network with processes.

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Re: Impressions from MS Connect

Hello, alex_public, you wrote: _> How much I see.NET Core is intended only for capture of the market of Web servers on Linux (dominating at present). It like as quite suits the given role. Not only. Xamarin, Unity for a mobile segment. Truth Xamarin it Mono, but the course on NetStandard and https://github.com/dotnet/core/blob/mas … map.md.NET Standard 2.0 support, bringing.NET Core to parity with a. net Framework and Mono for a large collection of base types is taken. And Samsung made Tizen C# API reference https://developer.tizen.org/development … -reference NET Core Framework (also known as CoreFx), which implements the.NET Base Class library, allows you to use the well known C# language base class libraries and features, such as collections, threading, file I/O, and LINQ.