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Topic: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Let's admit, you need to count the total on all accounts. Also there was a situation when the total on one of accounts is not installed (i.e. API does not return value of the total generally) though according to the interaction protocol such situation is eliminated. A choice: 1. Or to display the error report, to tell that on one of accounts the total it is not installed. But then even the approximate information at the user will not be. Can to it there will be a helpful information that there at least 1 million rbl. is, let at all it was not possible to consider all accounts. 2.  the total on accounts which are accessible, and there where protocol violation - . But then the user can be misled, after all some accounts  it was not possible. 3. To produce the message that was possible  100 accounts from 112, to produce that it turned out and to produce what accounts it was not possible to consider in view of a server error. Or other example. You need to count the amount of the goods accessible in all shops of your competitors. At each shop the API, independent. And at attempt to receive kol-in the goods, 3 shops from 100 returned an error. What to do? Not to display at all the information or  what returned an error and  the available data? Whether you faced similar systems, as usual solve these problems (a problem of incompleteness of the data, whether that)? And the question connected to it. What mechanism for information transfer about the collected errors is better for using? After all the exception (Exception) does not quit, it breaks execution process. Then return codes? More truly the list return code + the message?

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: whether S> you Faced similar systems, as usual solve these problems (a problem of incompleteness of the data, whether that)? Faced in a beginning of the career with similar (rather critical at that point in time) errors. Nobody knew, how them to process, and it was necessary. S> and the question connected to it. What mechanism for information transfer about the collected errors is better for using? After all the exception (Exception) does not quit, it breaks execution process. Then return codes? More truly the list return code + the message? Agreed to use the mechanism  on the basis of exceptions: when the system tries to obtain some times the data from a fail node, and each time is generated an exception, process repeats yet it is not possible to return clean data in general "coin box" or the counter of attempts ends. If the counter is nullified, and the data and is not received, from a node inconceivable value is returned, for example, "99999" - the data is doubtful, the subsequent algorithm of analysis of the data catches this erratic value and does not use in calculations. Also registers in the protocol that the data from such node is not received. Thus, it is conducted two registrations of an inaccuracy of the data: at level of algorithm of information collection and at level of algorithm of calculation of the data - the unauthenticity problem can be delegated (or to postpone the decision) for more advanced (strategically-conceiving) levels as lower layers made that could: tried to solve a problem, could-not could, fixed an error and did not allow to it to be spread above. So we got rid as well of the synchronous method of obtaining of the information when information collection from any one temporarily inaccessible node brakes all chain and the system rises. For information collection with N sites it is possible to involve a pool from M  (superficial flows) and it to solve a synchronism problem, translating it in .

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: whether S> you Faced similar systems, as usual solve these problems (a problem of incompleteness of the data, whether that)? I by operation with a dial-up   autoshops and their web services which have been written by car mechanicians, returned not one value, and the table, with instructions - who answered, and who - is not present, and for what time answered. S> then return codes? More truly the list return code + the message? Not return codes, and the certain structure comprising both successful results and errors.

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: S> It is admissible, you need to count the total on all accounts. Also there was a situation when the total on one of accounts is not installed (i.e. API does not return value of the total generally) though according to the interaction protocol such situation is eliminated. A choice: S> 1. Or to display the error report, to tell that on one of accounts the total it is not installed. But then even the approximate information at the user will not be. Can to it there will be a helpful information that there at least 1 million rbl. is, let at all it was not possible to consider all accounts. S> 2.  the total on accounts which are accessible, and there where protocol violation - . But then the user can be misled, after all some accounts  it was not possible. S> 3. To produce the message that was possible  100 accounts from 112, to produce that it turned out and to produce what accounts it was not possible to consider in view of a server error. The pestle - 3 is clear.

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, VladD2, you wrote: VD> the pestle - 3 Is clear. Well. And that if it is 1 function which returns value total. Where there to push the information on an error? Instead of decimal to return the object containing the list of errors? And then as them to display? Can it is simple in a broad gull-file? But after all the user does not look a broad gull-file. Means at update, at first to display a window with the list of errors (it is desirable floating), then to display the total? Or near the total to deliver an asterisk, at induction on which will be info about errors? On the protocol of the such should not be at all, it is necessary to correct on the server. But why that on the server made with protocol violation. Can simply display an error, the total not to display and tell that corrected on the server? And up until that time simply error and all here? After all at the head there is a protocol...

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: S> Well. And that if it is 1 function which returns value total. Where there to push the information on an error? Instead of decimal to return the object containing the list of errors? It is possible and so. And the list of results is even better, each of which envelop in certain Option (with standings Some (value) and None () or Error which instead of None will be to contain any additional information. S> and then as them to display? To you here a good variant offered with tabular representation. And generally, here it is necessary more details the nobility. What for the data? What for they to the client? What their importance? S> can it is simple in a broad gull-file? Depends on the previous questions. But, most likely, it will be interesting to the user that results not exact. If to the user enough the approximate data it is possible to try locally  old results and to count mean value. So an error it will be minimum. S> but after all the user does not look a broad gull-file. Means at update, at first to display a window with the list of errors (it is desirable floating), then to display the total? Or near the total to deliver an asterisk, at induction on which will be info about errors? A window stupidly close without looking. It is necessary so to write nearby and not an asterisk, and the huge red text to (SHOUT). Generally always recognize that on the average your user -  and to read and thought is not able. So to do so that even  and to the full mole all it was clear. If there is a possibility to understand not so, someone precisely understands not so, and the window passes. S> on the protocol of the such should not be at all, it is necessary to correct on the server. But why that on the server made with protocol violation. Well, so can it is necessary repair the server? In other communication on determination a thing unreliable. So it is necessary to calculate for failures always. Reliable systems is not systems in which there are no errors, and systems which are ready to their appearance. S> Can simply display an error, the total not to display and tell that corrected on the server? You should ask it the user. We tell if you consider  a file the sense in a miscalculation - is not present. But if it is turns any there on branches, thousand branches, and 2-3 from them (and small) do not respond, to the user it can be interesting and not the exact total. An optimal variant - to give to the user a choice. On-default you write "!" Also you give switches "to look without fail nodes", "to look with  values for fail nodes". Well, the variant with the table, besides, is good. S> and up until that time simply error and all here? After all at the head there is a protocol... Ask users. They that, are inaccessible?

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, VladD2, you wrote: VD> Well so can it is necessary repair the server? In other communication on determination a thing unreliable. So it is necessary to calculate for failures always. Reliable systems is not systems in which there are no errors, and systems which are ready to their appearance. In! Idea remarkable. But the system should be how much floppy? Here, for example, we take this forum and it API. API gives estimations for the message, let on the protocol value-1, 1, 2, 3 (for simplicity) is admissible. And suddenly there there is a value "" which is not provided by the protocol. What to do? Not to display generally an estimation for the message where there are values not provided by the protocol? Or  that that is not provided by the protocol? VD> on-default you write "!" And where it is better to write it? In a window with an error? Or it is better to make a special broad gull of errors,  it permanently was before eyes, instead of there somewhere under a cowl? Whether there were to you examples where the such is implemented?

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: whether S> you Faced similar systems, as usual solve these problems (a problem of incompleteness of the data, whether that)? S> And the question connected to it. What mechanism for information transfer about the collected errors is better for using? After all the exception (Exception) does not quit, it breaks execution process. Then return codes? More truly the list return code + the message?  dictated digits, and Pepper typed them, pushed multiplication and division keys, added, subtracted, derived roots, and all went, as usual. - Twelve on ten, - Kim told. - to Increase. - One zero the zero seven, mechanically dictated Pepper, and then thought suddenly and told: - Listen, it after all says lies. There should be hundred twenty. - I Know, I know, - Kim impatiently told. - One zero a zero seven, - was repeated by him. - now derive to me a root from ten zero seven... - Now, - Pepper told

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: S> Here, for example, we take this forum and it API. API gives estimations for the message, let on the protocol value-1, 1, 2, 3 (for simplicity) is admissible. And suddenly there there is a value "" which is not provided by the protocol. What to do? Not to display generally an estimation for the message where there are values not provided by the protocol? Or  that that is not provided by the protocol? If the server gives = not approaching to the protocol - means, or at you the wrong specification, or  programmers of the server. How much it is critical - depends on the task. In a case with an estimation at a forum - the world does not perish, and this error can be ignored. If the server produces  in system SPRN is a wrecking in especially large, item 58,  1,7,9,11, 14 avalon/2.0.3

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Glory, you wrote: Not return codes, and the certain structure comprising both successful results and errors. Which can quite be filled with the information on errors in an exception handler if so it is convenient.... <<RSDN@Home 1.0.0 alpha 5 rev. 0>>

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, biochemist, you wrote: B> B> - One zero the zero seven, mechanically dictated Pepper, and then thought suddenly and told: B> - Listen, it after all says lies. There should be hundred twenty. B> - I Know, I know, - Kim impatiently told. In-in. Conciseness of these systems as a whole - misses.

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: S> It is admissible, you need to count the total on all accounts. Also there was a situation when the total on one of accounts is not installed (i.e. API does not return value of the total generally) though according to the interaction protocol such situation is eliminated. A choice: the customer should know It. If does not know, offer variants, including cost of their spelling, let selects and states.

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: S> Here, for example, we take this forum and it API. API gives estimations for the message, let on the protocol value-1, 1, 2, 3 (for simplicity) is admissible. And suddenly there there is a value "" which is not provided by the protocol. What to do? Not to display generally an estimation for the message where there are values not provided by the protocol? Or  that that is not provided by the protocol? This forum gives as result - the text (XTML). And does it through AJAX (asynchronously). The client script stupidly displays that sent. Send a smilie, displays it. This bug at its finest and to try to process somehow it - silly. It should be gone and corrected. Much more interesting a question what to do at time delays in an exchange. Here we quite often have a situation when you press yes in dialogue to an estimation, and it brakes and is not closed. Whether also the horse-radish knows it there transited sending request about setting of an estimation or  the answer. Here this behavior very much strains. On mind it is necessary to do such exchange asynchronously. To send an estimation until then the answer does not come yet. Well, at least reasonable number of times (and with a reasonable time delay). S> And where it is better to write it? In a window with an error? There where result you deduce. In an example with an estimation I would make so (if would be engaged in it and it would be not a pity to time). At estimation acknowledgement locally would add it to current value, but would change its color on any other, signaling that this yet server value. Well, and on the timer, with a time delay of seconds in 5 would send requests about estimation change. The answer would receive asynchronously, in the handler on . If the answer comes, the timer acts in film, actual value of an estimation is deduced, and its color changes on the normal. By the way, it is possible estimations generally on the timer to request. It even would be healthy, if update of estimations in real time was visible. S> Or it is better to make a special broad gull of errors,  it permanently was before eyes, instead of there somewhere under a cowl? Whether there were to you examples where the such is implemented? I already time 10 answered you that it depends exceptional on tasks and the purposes of the user. In any case the broad gull is a decision. In any the user generally cannot be guided on not the exact data. In any it is necessary to show all details. In any to calculate the approximated result. Contact clients and ask them: 1. The data is how much important? 2. What is accuracy (correctness) or an urgency more important? 3. How to display the data in case of their absence from some hosts? Hearing answers to questions, you can make the decision.

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, VladD2, you wrote: VD> This forum gives as result - the text (XTML). And does it through AJAX (asynchronously). The client script stupidly displays that sent. Send a smilie, displays it. I about API speak. Here is API, for estimations values only-1, 1, 2, 3 are admissible. For an example, can here and differently. You in the client add all estimations and deduce a total amount. And suddenly there is a new value - a smilie. By the protocol it is not provided. What to do? Try to transform to number - there is an error. The user means or: 1. At all does not see the message forum. 2. Sees the message, but does not see an estimation. 3. Sees an estimation on a basis not gross data, without a smilie.

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: S> I about API speak. Here is API, for estimations values only-1, 1, 2, 3 are admissible. For an example, can here and differently. S> you in the client add all estimations and deduce a total amount. You do not listen to me. In Web implementation is not present such . Is  - to transfer an estimation, to receive the text for filling DIV. In a web service for Janus the list  is returned. If there something not that returns, well there will be an embarkation. It is a bug in the program. It it is necessary to correct, instead of to cover. Not that case. S> and suddenly there is a new value - a smilie. By the protocol it is not provided. What to do? Try to transform to number - there is an error. The user means or: I was already tired to answer. All it depends on nuances. If the server and  yours that  to be engaged? Correct a bug and move further. If  the stranger you and variants have less. Here already at the user it is necessary ... More shortly, read that above on a branch is written. What sense to repeat?

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, VladD2, you wrote: VD> In a web service for Janus the list  is returned. If there something not that returns, well there will be an embarkation. It is a bug in the program. It it is necessary to correct, instead of to cover. How in an ideal the program should react to a bug? For example, a bug on the server with estimations. A variant: 1. Or only to display an error, but not to display the message and it . 2. Or to display only the message, and instead of estimations to deliver red exclamation point. 3. Or to display both message and those estimations which satisfy to the protocol. After all it is possible to work out initially one approach for cases when not the data is correct.

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, iZEN, you wrote: ZEN>... From a node inconceivable value is returned, for example, "99999" It is said that at sources Y2K stood innocent : we install unattainable date - 9/9/99

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: S> After all it is possible to work out initially one approach for cases when not the data is correct. It is impossible. Even by your examples it is visible. It is quite possible to show the forum message without estimations. In that example which about an amount of the goods at competitors needs to be accompanied total digit the comment like - "the data is collected on N to sources from M subject to monitoring" There where the total of money on different accounts it is necessary explicitly  "Residual under account NNN in bank XXXXXXX it was not possible to receive", and it is better in a general view a cause of error, and in a broad gull more specific information.... <<RSDN@Home 1.0.0 alpha 5 rev. 0>>

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, pagid, you wrote: P> it is quite possible to show the forum Message without estimations. P> in that example which about an amount of the goods at competitors needs to be accompanied total digit the comment like - "the data is collected on N to sources from M subject to monitoring" And unless at a forum it is not useful to supply the message with a similar comment? P> there where the total of money on different accounts it is necessary explicitly  "Residual under account NNN in bank XXXXXXX it was not possible to receive", and it is better in a general view a cause of error, and in a broad gull more specific information. Similarly and with forum messages, not bad to display such error, but not to interrupt process completely.

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: S> It is admissible, you need to count the total on all accounts. Also there was a situation when the total on one of accounts is not installed (i.e. API does not return value of the total generally) though according to the interaction protocol such situation is eliminated. Even if the protocol would always be fulfilled can eliminate nobody a situation of banal absence of communication with the target server. S> a choice: S> 1. Or to display the error report, to tell that on one of accounts the total it is not installed. But then even the approximate information at the user will not be. Can to it there will be a helpful information that there at least 1 million rbl. is, let at all it was not possible to consider all accounts. S> 2.  the total on accounts which are accessible, and there where protocol violation - . But then the user can be misled, after all some accounts  it was not possible. S> 3. To produce the message that was possible  100 accounts from 112, to produce that it turned out and to produce what accounts it was not possible to consider in view of a server error. Obviously the answer depends on that what scenario is necessary to the user. I suppose in most cases it there will be a third variant. But in a case with volume count  in a folder can quite approach and the second. The first variant - disrespect for the user anyway and should not to be used. S> And the question connected to it. What mechanism for information transfer about the collected errors is better for using? After all the exception (Exception) does not quit, it breaks execution process. Then return codes? More truly the list return code + the message? It just one of few cases when exceptions is possible and it is necessary to intercept and process.

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Re: To count with an error or to produce the error report?

Hello, Shmj, you wrote: S> And unless at a forum it is not useful to supply the message with a similar comment? It is useless. But if users are ready to pay so deeply waste application or the author is ready to waste time in case of the free supplement, it is possible to display somehow a problem with estimations visually, but  it is not mandatory. And here text, full and certainly such which user to pass the message in a case with the total on accounts cannot is absolutely necessary.... <<RSDN@Home 1.0.0 alpha 5 rev. 0>>