51

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Alexander Kuznetsov, you wrote: > Any trip at the wheel can end with failure. Not important on whose fault. It is possible to be the megaabrupt driver, but to catch on a route  because of the traffic which has burst at another participant of a wheel. And to catch in a situation when chances to evade are not present any, be you though 10 times the racer of the formula one. Them too it is regular from safety frames "cut", if that. Undoubtedly. > During a rain visibility, the review in side mirrors is reduced, the brake way etc., and, hence, increases the probability of road accident considerably increases at all participants of traffic. At the beginner, the first time sat down for a wheel, it  with, we admit (digits are made up), 1 % on 1000 km to 5 %, at real "pro" with experience, skills of extremal driving etc. - from 0.01 % to 0.03 %. But  at all. C "considerably" it do not agree. In remaining, APPRX. > the Real method to lower probability of road accident in a situation when it is impossible to affect other drivers, there is only one - to give to itself(himself) to more time for response. To reach it it is possible: > 1. Possibility to manoeuvre, brake etc. > 2 was magnification of a distance to other machines of a flow that if they start to do something not that. Lowering of speed that time for response, besides, increased, and, in case of road accident, consequences were less heavy. E = mV^2/2 still nobody cancelled. > 3. Increase of the general vigilance, type "to twist a head on 360 degrees" and to start to count other drivers not on 1-2, and on 2-3 steps forward. The probability of road accident decreases in the presence of a working backup plan of actions. That you enumerated are only separate aspects of its creation. There are also others. > All. Personally I do not know other methods. > From this it follows that drivers who during a rain reduce speed, fulfill, at least, one of the enumerated recommendations, and try to lower the probability which has increased because of weather conditions of road accident. So are good and suitable drivers. No, does not mean. Good and suitable they would be, if used points 3 and 1 first of all. And only at their insufficiency - item 2. But, a problem that 3 it is impossible to include simply. It it is necessary to be able.

52

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Tyomchik, you wrote: Those> the stub Icon blinks a post factum when you thanks to computer interference did not depart.  interferes earlier, still before the driver could understand something. The subject, the good driver knows that the machine can slip still before it begins . At "computer" of this knowledge is not present.

53

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Tyomchik, you wrote: Those> Hello, wraithik, you wrote: W>>>> As you the limit of coupling with a speed  connected? It only turn it is possible to connect, on a straight line though 300 fry. Those>>> Losinyj the test? Not, did not hear. W>> not the psychic, thought I am not able to read. The losinyj test it just 4 turns. Those> You at us were going 300km/ch to do on a straight line. Was video as a mustang on a straight line on 270 twirled and unreeled. Means not absolutely direct and equal. Those>>> a coupling Limit, it when takes down a muzzle or when the stub icon blinks. But to pilots on buckets with bolts on hydroplaning (100km/ch - more than it is enough) and without any electronic assistants (an electrostub, ABS, expensive rubber for cowards) it not to understand. W>> at me now the machine with , , rubber at me all life UHP is put. Essentially differences in driving with  and without it I do not see,  only hardly faster me extinguishes sliding. Normal drivers define a limit on behavior of the machine, instead of on bulb . Those> the stub Icon blinks a post factum when you thanks to computer interference did not depart.  interferes earlier, still before the driver could understand something. , it at you it so blinks, and I me a wheel towards drift on reflexes am turned, still before you his eyes will see. But here speed of my response and  nevertheless is less than at a computer, there generally 0.1  a campaign suffices. W>> we wait when the Lancer finds the pool, there  does not rescue. You think Q7 was without , on a shit to rubber etc.? Those> Before  it is necessary to drop speed. Yours TO. Here people also go to have time to drop speed, instead of on a limit. I tin you you can and not see. In 2-3 rubber crushes a film almost on any speed, and here 10 (is easy roughness which it is not visible) any more the fact that presses through, and the machine floats. Further, though  though without  - you will depart.

54

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, wraithik, you wrote: W> Artem, it at you it so blinks, and I me a wheel towards drift on reflexes am turned, still before you his eyes will see. But here speed of my response and  nevertheless is less than at a computer, there generally 0.1  a campaign suffices. Most likely suffices. , the modern units ABS of 12-16 pulses in a second are able to produce. That is, actuating time <1/12 with.

55

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Lexey, you wrote: >> the Real method to lower probability of road accident in a situation when it is impossible to affect other drivers, there is only one - to give to itself(himself) to more time for response. To reach it it is possible: >> 1. Possibility to manoeuvre, brake etc. >> 2 was magnification of a distance to other machines of a flow that if they start to do something not that. Lowering of speed that time for response, besides, increased, and, in case of road accident, consequences were less heavy. E = mV^2/2 still nobody cancelled. >> 3. Increase of the general vigilance, type "to twist a head on 360 degrees" and to start to count other drivers not on 1-2, and on 2-3 steps forward. L> the probability of road accident decreases in the presence of a working backup plan of actions. That you enumerated are only separate aspects of its creation. There are also others. Quite I admit, though it would be desirable to look at remaining points of this plan. Naturally, I mean that it is possible to make on road here and now, instead of variants of preliminary preparation of type "to leave during other time", "in advance to transit courses a driving extreme", "to select the machine with big  on safety" etc. It is meant that their reasonable people try to do on-default in process of the possibilities, the purposes and real experience. >> All. Personally I do not know other methods. >> From this it follows that drivers who during a rain reduce speed, fulfill, at least, one of the enumerated recommendations, and try to lower the probability which has increased because of weather conditions of road accident. So are good and suitable drivers. L> is not present, does not mean. Good and suitable they would be, if used points 3 and 1 first of all. And only at their insufficiency - item 2. The statement the extremely disputable, at least because distance magnification between machines in a flow in city conditions automatically causes average rate lowering. Stupidly on traffic light switching have time to pass not 10 machines, and 8-9, plus at  numbers of drivers turnes on "well " at journey on the turning pink yellow.-5 km to average rate generally without problems. Besides, so dashing to dismiss a measure on which energy of shock in case of possible road accident (which probability quadratically depends, I remind, raised)... Everyone solves for itself(himself), of course, but in my opinion, it is the extremely unreasonable act. L> but, a problem that 3 it is impossible to include simply. It it is necessary to be able. Even to try I will not argue. Also it completely agree that it is far not at all drivers. But, I will underline, road - a place of the general use. And the grandmother-pensioner who together with me in driving school studied in due time that after death of the grandfather of times in week on a summer residence somehow to go, precisely also has the right to be on this road (if handed over, it is finite). And to expect from it point 3 performance, at least as regards forecasting of actions of other drivers, it is somehow unreasonable. So, with it only 1 and 2 remain.

56

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Alexander Kuznetsov, you wrote: L>> the Probability of road accident decreases in the presence of a working backup plan of actions. That you enumerated are only separate aspects of its creation. There are also others. > Quite I admit, though it would be desirable to look at remaining points of this plan. Naturally, I mean that it is possible to make on road here and now, instead of variants of preliminary preparation of type "to leave during other time","in advance to transit courses a driving extreme","to select the machine with big  on safety" etc. It is meant that their reasonable people try to do on-default in process of the possibilities, the purposes and real experience." Here and now ", really, anything except yours 1 and 2 not to make. All remaining demands preliminary planning, training of certain skills, etc. L>> Is not present, does not mean. Good and suitable they would be, if used points 3 and 1 first of all. And only at their insufficiency - item 2. > the Statement the extremely disputable >, at least because the distance magnification between machines in a flow in city conditions automatically causes average rate lowering. > it is stupid on traffic light switching have time to pass not 10 machines, and 8-9, plus at  numbers of drivers turnes on" well  "at journey on the turning pink yellow.-5 km to average rate generally without problems. In the theory - can be. And in our reality throughput of a traffic light is defined at all by a distance between machines for the speed, and with what intensity the people get under way and dispersed from a traffic light. And here all is sad and without distances and rains - the people  even . > Besides so dashing to dismiss a measure on which energy of shock in case of possible road accident (which probability quadratically depends, I remind, raised)... Everyone solves for itself(himself), of course, but in my opinion, it is the extremely unreasonable act. Increased a distance - increased a brake way, and reduced energy of shock. L>> but, a problem that 3 it is impossible to include simply. It it is necessary to be able. > Even to try I will not argue. Also it completely agree that it is far not at all drivers. But, I will underline, road - a place of the general use. And the grandmother-pensioner who together with me in driving school studied in due time that after death of the grandfather of times in week on a summer residence somehow to go, precisely also has the right to be on this road (if handed over, it is finite). And to expect from it point 3 performance, at least as regards forecasting of actions of other drivers, somehow unreasonably. So, with it only 1 and 2 remain. And I also do not expect, but also "the suitable" driver I it will not begin to name.

57

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, wraithik, you wrote: W> Artem, it at you it so blinks, and I me a wheel towards drift on reflexes am turned, still before you his eyes will see. In case of hydroplaning this reflex can render you clumsy assistance. The most reasonable in this case to hold wheels directly, and to hold a wheel properly - and that it and from hands can beat out.

58

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Lexey, you wrote: L> In the theory - can be. And in our reality throughput of a traffic light is defined at all by a distance between machines for the speed, and with what intensity the people get under way and dispersed from a traffic light. And here all is sad and without distances and rains - the people  even . About alternative realities I do not know, can, there physics another, but here in which I live in a reality, the distance between machines directly influences an amount of machines which have time to pass a traffic light for  time. Both for the speed, and in process  and acceleration. L> increased a distance - increased a brake way, and reduced energy of shock. To ahead going machine - yes. To machines in adjacent rows - it is not always possible. Well and the same pedestrians are very feeblly processed by distance magnification. L>>> but, a problem that 3 it is impossible to include simply. It it is necessary to be able. >> Even to try I will not argue. Also it completely agree that it is far not at all drivers. But, I will underline, road - a place of the general use. And the grandmother-pensioner who together with me in driving school studied in due time that after death of the grandfather of times in week on a summer residence somehow to go, precisely also has the right to be on this road (if handed over, it is finite). And to expect from it point 3 performance, at least as regards forecasting of actions of other drivers, it is somehow unreasonable. So, with it only 1 and 2 remain. L> and I also do not expect, but also "the suitable" driver I it will not begin to name. Suitable - and I will not become. But adequate provided that it commensurates speed and other factors on which it can influence, with the real possibilities, quite.

59

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

And that is why. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvC-J2eKIic

60

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, yenik, you wrote: Y> And that is why. Interesting, it is a foreshortening of the camera such or "at them" it is accepted to save bulbs in headlights "?

61

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

L> it is interesting, it is a foreshortening of the camera such or "at them" it is accepted to save bulbs in headlights "? Headlights increase fuel consumption. And so they, probably, reduce the carbon footprint, escape from global warming. To us not to understand.

62

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, koandrew, you wrote: K> Hello, wraithik, you wrote: W>> Artem, it at you it so blinks, and I me a wheel towards drift on reflexes am turned, still before you his eyes will see. K> in case of hydroplaning this reflex can render you clumsy assistance. The most reasonable in this case to hold wheels directly, and to hold a wheel properly - and that it and from hands can beat out. In case of emersion the machine itself does not go to drift, at least at once. The muzzle floats at first. I  emersion on 130, easy dropped speed. During this moment the machine not , and it at once you feel on a wheel.

63

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Tyomchik, you wrote: Those> Hello, koandrew, you wrote: W>>> Artem, it at you it so blinks, and I me a wheel towards drift on reflexes am turned, still before you his eyes will see. K>> in case of hydroplaning this reflex can render you clumsy assistance. The most reasonable in this case to hold wheels directly, and to hold a wheel properly - and that it and from hands can beat out. Those> wraithik itself does not understand that does. For so-called" Reflex turn of a wheel towards drift "not that other, as operation ESC. ESC brakes wheels from drift-> a wheel it is turned. And here to go without ESC, especially on  and-or to friable surfaces, it is direct way to twirl or depart after the journey to test natural reflexes. A subject, you tore. At me two machines now, one without  on which I drove 10 years, the second with . Both with . And still I here have snow and ice where it is possible  and to look as it is all  works on reasonable speeds. You do not know  only.

64

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, wraithik, you wrote: W> In case of emersion the machine itself does not go to drift, at least at once. And it already as the card lays down. A breeze there successful sideways or after emersion one side catches road before another - and greetings driving by side

65

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Tyomchik, you wrote: Those> wraithik itself does not understand that does. For so-called "reflex turn of a wheel towards drift" not that other, as operation ESC. ESC brakes wheels from drift-> a wheel it is turned. And here to go without ESC, especially on  and-or to friable surfaces, it is direct way to twirl or depart after the journey to test natural reflexes. A subject, you from what oak failed? Even on dry asphalt reactive responses cannot turn a wheel, if it normally to hold. About "a direct way" too it is ridiculous, but about it I already in other post wrote.

66

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Tyomchik, you wrote: Those> At you were situations when driving wheels nonuniformly are pumped up? It was possible to me on a disk with rubber lumps in front to go on  the SOU on race. On  there to 140 was. Those> the Wheel conducts aside where the wheel is less beefy. In a case with a back drive - the same, conducts in that side where the wheel is lowered a little. Did not reflect, why? Well conducts, and what? You can not retain hands a wheel? Those> And about what at you and a difference with/without ESP you do not note 2 machines. Well the shit yours ESP means. Or on the contrary negovno - depends on your perception of a reality. Someone does not like too much interference, type it is necessary to them that moved so moved, that adrenaline before ESP wakes up. It is pleasant to me that ESP interferes early and rigidly. OMG if at you ESP on asphalt works on public roads hand over the rights is better, it was not killed yet. About 2 machines to you wraithik wrote, instead of I. At me the previous 2 machines were without ESP (the second has meaningly been bought without it). On current is, for in basis goes. Any difference in respect of driving for me ESP does not give. Occasionally works in court yard in an ice track or if a bench hammer to pull, beforehand it without disconnecting. Those> PS "the blinking icon of a stub" arises only at proslippings, for example as during a rain from a traffic light broke wheels in boxes. It is antiboxes, instead of stabilizing.

67

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Ops, you wrote: Ops> That for a pool on MKAD? It is possible coordinates? The second row at the left, a track with water

68

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Ops, you wrote: S>> the Acquaintance on a section Kemerovo - Novokuznetsk (there a highway with restriction in 110) similarly got. It is good that speed was nearby 80 - was retained. Ops> and it it is exact in a pool got, instead of in a shower ? We here about a small rain, as though. Well at a small rain when it begins, generally it is smartly possible to depart, while the dust becomes final impregnated with a moisture.

69

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Real 3L0, you wrote: R3> There was a subject where I clarified it: http://rsdn.org/forum/auto/7006393.1 the Author: Real 3L0 Date: 28.12 17:16

70

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Bigger, you wrote: B> the Second row at the left, a track with water Never saw there without a shower that in a track there was a water. Can at night I go a little, and in the afternoon before you already 100 machines squeezed out it.

71

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Bigger, you wrote: B> Well at a small rain when it begins, generally it is smartly possible to depart, while the dust becomes final impregnated with a moisture. Where you so much dust found it? Whether on a grader that?

72

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, landerhigh, you wrote: L> Hello, wraithik, you wrote: W>> In case of emersion the machine itself does not go to drift, at least at once. L> And it already as the card lays down. A breeze there successful sideways or after emersion one side catches road before another - and greetings driving by side It after emersion and .

73

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, Ops, you wrote: Ops> Hello, Bigger, you wrote: B>> Well at a small rain when it begins, generally it is smartly possible to depart, while the dust becomes final impregnated with a moisture. Ops> where you so much dust found it? Whether on a grader that? It it is not necessary much. The wheel badly presses through a wet dust, it very slippery. It is possible to depart really easily.

74

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, wraithik, you wrote: L>> And it already as the card lays down. A breeze there successful sideways or after emersion one side catches road before another - and greetings driving by side W> It after emersion and . After the driver became the passenger, it already does not depend on the driver.

75

Re: Re: Why many drivers in the rain?

Hello, landerhigh, you wrote: L> Hello, wraithik, you wrote: L>>> And it already as the card lays down. A breeze there successful sideways or after emersion one side catches road before another - and greetings driving by side W>> It after emersion and . L> After the driver became the passenger, it already does not depend on the driver. The task to hold a wheel on driving that when it will be linked not to depart. That you describe that, it is a good pool and a hummock inside when 4 wheels float, and one  with a wheel not in the direction of travel or on braking is the instant embarkation.