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Topic: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

The title of this article reflects about what notified  at the conference which have taken place on October, 24th, 2017 during an exhibition "Tehnoforum-2017" in  "Expocentre". We suppose, nix.ru it will be interesting to unlimited readership to learn, how our western partners can "ungear" Russian . More in detail the link 01.03.18 19:34: It is transferred from ' the Policy'

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, rustler, you wrote: R> how our western partners can "ungear" Russian . The turmoil is postponed a minimum for 5 years. Now is not present the slightest chances of power change. Even if the small group  also runs out - will be quickly suppressed. And only any monks the Author: Shmj Date: 01.03 14:22 that the world behind the scenes delivers you Grudinina. But that such 5 years for history...

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, swame, you wrote: S> And it can is simple imaginations ? I have no business with machine-tool construction, so all from someone's words. But heard that in a software of expensive machine tools  probes so many that Win10 fair system seems. And generally there very original software license agreements. If so all is possible. Simply here did not meet a direct mention of real switch-off of the machine tool.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

M> it is not clear why even speech does not go about somehow to secure already available equipment against shut-down. A horse-radish you will secure - if the machine tool loses touch with the vendor it is ungeared, if the vendor "does not prolong activation" too is ungeared. Write that in some machine tools even the gyroscope is to stop all attempts it somewhere to transport. The machine-tool construction so important piece that duties in 500 % are pertinent.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, hi_octane, you wrote: M>> it is not clear why even speech does not go about somehow to secure already available equipment against shut-down. _> a horse-radish you will secure - if the machine tool loses touch with the vendor it is ungeared, if the vendor "does not prolong activation" too is ungeared. Write that in some machine tools even the gyroscope is to stop all attempts it somewhere to transport. If it is thoughtful to a question to approach: something to grunt, somewhere generally the code anew to write, somewhere the resistor-transistor superfluous  or to solder, very probably it would be possible and to secure. _> The machine-tool construction so important piece that duties in 500 % are pertinent. It yes. Here only to develop there much it is necessary almost from zero. And generally precision machine tools and contribution links were a problem also in Soviet period.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

M> If it is thoughtful to a question to approach: something to grunt, somewhere generally the code anew to write, somewhere the resistor-transistor superfluous  or to solder, very probably it would be possible and to secure. Only if something is made though a little . If good enciphering - unsigned the vendor the code is not launched on the processor and all.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, hi_octane, you wrote: M>> If it is thoughtful to a question to approach: something to grunt, somewhere generally the code anew to write, somewhere the resistor-transistor superfluous  or to solder, very probably it would be possible and to secure. _> only if something is made though a little . If good enciphering - unsigned the vendor the code is not launched on the processor and all. Well here games consoles do not launch the unsigned code, however them crack nevertheless. I to that, as say that in the presence of resources for this business, the most different variants are possible. Stop here can, certainly the miss price. It not pair-triple   at experiments.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

M> Simply here did not meet a direct mention of real switch-off of the machine tool. I first-hand heard the story as at one factory in  bought the machine tool in which the geometry of a detail boots and at the operator literally three buttons - to "begin", "stop" and unnecessary. There was a machine tool model in which it is possible was to load also how many pieces of details to make, but it cost more expensive strongly, therefore bought that which does by the piece - in calculation that to buttons solder  and them will "push" without the operator.  there, the miracle of technics and without the Internet defined at once interference and was disconnected for ever and completely.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, hi_octane, you wrote: M>> Simply here did not meet a direct mention of real switch-off of the machine tool. _> I first-hand heard the story as at one factory in  bought the machine tool in which the geometry of a detail boots and at the operator literally three buttons - to "begin", "stop" and unnecessary. There was a machine tool model in which it is possible was to load also how many pieces of details to make, but it cost more expensive strongly, therefore bought that which does by the piece - in calculation that to buttons solder  and them will "push" without the operator.  there, the miracle of technics and without the Internet defined at once interference and was disconnected for ever and completely. The Interesting story. But that there is a protection against opening it for a long time it is known, and buttons with check on authenticity already even in  stand for a long time. Here if attached the exterior device really pushing the button and the machine tool managed to define it. Generally, unfortunately, IT and electronics development gave also possibility to vendors to become impudent to a limit. But I that about direct sabotage for the political reasons yet did not meet examples. If it is real in Crimea such inscription appeared, this in itself news.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, Michael7, you wrote: M> But heard that in a software of expensive machine tools  probes so many that Win10 fair system seems. And generally there very original software license agreements. If so all is possible. Simply here did not meet a direct mention of real switch-off of the machine tool. I work with machine tools and robots on manufacture some years, and never saw any probe. So it is all  for those who not in a subject.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, koandrew, you wrote: K> I work with machine tools and robots on manufacture some years, and never saw any probe. So it is all  for those who not in a subject. If the machine tool without constant or incidental Internet communication with the vendor does not work, here and a probe. Well also it is a question about expensive enough and exact machine tools.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, Michael7, you wrote: M> If it is thoughtful to a question to approach: something to grunt, somewhere generally the code anew to write, somewhere the resistor-transistor superfluous  or to solder, very probably it would be possible and to secure. From such breakings protection in 19 century used.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, hi_octane, you wrote: M>> it is not clear why even speech does not go about somehow to secure already available equipment against shut-down. _> a horse-radish you will secure - if the machine tool loses touch with the vendor it is ungeared, if the vendor "does not prolong activation" too is ungeared. Write that in some machine tools even the gyroscope is to stop all attempts it somewhere to transport. It is very similar to rubbish. To put GPS in high-precision machine tools and by that to "protect" from sale (pen) to Iran - silly. From 120 % probability machine tools will stand in a strong ferro-concrete building = well screened from signal GPS in the most natural, inadvertent image. So in this part delirium. And here the vibration \moving sensor in the HIGH-PRECISION machine tool is mandatory and on it the logic of operation is fastened. Correctly installed machine tool in operation to give details really to SPLIT-HAIR ACCURACY should to stand strongly. If the machine tool starts to test in an operating time superfluous vibrations it fatally affects accuracy of a product as the maximum leads to the claim to the vendor and potential judicial disassemblings with payment of penalties, and at least breakage of working organs (cutters \mills \bends the laser / other). The mill 10 turns a remarkable gyroscope,  the machine tool on the feeble base such mill can badly space apart a shop floor. I consider, the owner of the machine tool forces of wonderful athletes () () transferred the machine tool on the bad place, and the vendor told it a fairy tale for suckers. _> The machine-tool construction so important piece that duties in 500 % are pertinent. Undoubtedly.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, Michael7, you wrote: M> Well here games consoles do not launch the unsigned code, however them crack nevertheless. In  there are no circuits of self-damage after interference. Then they are cheap, and attempt of breaking of the machine tool leads to its physical unfitness, and it will be strong 10000 prefixes.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, Michael7, you wrote: M> If the machine tool without constant or incidental Internet communication with the vendor will not work, here and a probe. Well also it is a question about expensive enough and exact machine tools. What %; No "? Connects machine tools to the Internet? ?

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, koandrew, you wrote: K> What %; No "? Connects machine tools to the Internet? ?" For improving of quality of production, sending of dens, bugs"

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, marcopolo, you wrote: M> "For improving of quality of production, sending of dens, bugs" I yet did not meet idiots in engineers of manufacture. Too big responsibility.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, koandrew, you wrote: M>> "For improving of quality of production, sending of dens, bugs" K> I yet did not meet idiots in engineers of manufacture. Too big responsibility. Generally it is a well-known problem, not only Russian, but at even German. Japanese and Americans know, as in what amount Germans for the account of deliveries to them of the modern machine tools produce. I do not know into the connection account to an Internet, but we admit at purchase the certain amount of operations after which the licensed engineer comes is licensed, takes away broad gulls, tests a device then the vendor in the different form buys new licenses. The modern machine tools build in GPS sensors, seismosensors which hinder with their relocation.

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, Nik, you wrote: N> Generally it is a well-known problem, not only Russian, but at even German. Japanese and Americans know, as in what amount Germans for the account of deliveries to them of the modern machine tools produce. I do not know into the connection account to an Internet, but it is admissible at purchase the certain amount of operations after which the licensed engineer comes is licensed, takes away broad gulls, tests a device then the vendor in the different form buys new licenses. Differently happens. Some machine tools and robots at us are completely supported by the vendor, but the most part support forces of engineers of manufacture - with our help regarding a software and integration. N> the modern machine tools build in GPS sensors, seismosensors which hinder with their relocation. Did not meet the such. GPS sensors generally are useless, since At us almost everywhere in shops the building is screened (that internal signals did not litter an ether outside and on the contrary - that exterior signals did not prevent operation of internal systems of communication).

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, koandrew, you wrote: N>> Generally it is a well-known problem, not only Russian, but at even German. Japanese and Americans know, as in what amount Germans for the account of deliveries to them of the modern machine tools produce. I do not know into the connection account to an Internet, but it is admissible at purchase the certain amount of operations after which the licensed engineer comes is licensed, takes away broad gulls, tests a device then the vendor in the different form buys new licenses. K> Differently happens. Some machine tools and robots at us are completely supported by the vendor, but the most part support forces of engineers of manufacture - with our help regarding a software and integration. Well you not in Germany? N>> the modern machine tools build in GPS sensors, seismosensors which hinder with their relocation. K> did not meet the such. GPS sensors generally are useless, since At us almost everywhere in shops the building is screened (that internal signals did not litter an ether outside and on the contrary - that exterior signals did not prevent operation of internal systems of communication). To the accelerometer  not a noise: https://habrahabr.ru/post/208390/

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, Nik, you wrote: N> Well you not in Germany? And I about Germany also do not speak N> to the Accelerometer  not a noise: N> https://habrahabr.ru/post/208390/Only to sense from it all the same any. Here it is necessary high-grade IME. But then there is a question - what normal engineer of manufacture agrees to pay for these "" if competitors have all the same, but without these, forgive My God, "features"?

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, hi_octane, you wrote: _> I first-hand heard the story as at one factory in  bought the machine tool in which the geometry of a detail boots and at the operator literally three buttons - to "begin", "stop" and unnecessary On what principle it works? How the 3D-printer?

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Re: In case of a turmoil our defensive industry simply ungear

Hello, koandrew, you wrote: K> Hello, Michael7, you wrote: M>> But heard that in a software of expensive machine tools  probes so many that Win10 fair system seems. And generally there very original software license agreements. If so all is possible. Simply here did not meet a direct mention of real switch-off of the machine tool. K> I work with machine tools and robots on manufacture some years, and never saw any probe. So it is all  for those who not in a subject. You work with an old shit. Here esteem: http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/dm … ng-273841/ Also I will result the first post: Hi there, Came across this wonderful forum hoping to solve or at least understand my issue. Our company had purchased 8 Mori's (NV5000A's) and recently we've moved the assets to another plant. We were told that in order to get the machines operable we needed to have Ellison come out and unlock the machines. We've been told by Mori that this is a new requirement of the US government and that all future machine mfg's are moving to this. Have any of you heard of such rubbish and has anyone found a work around.